The U is Silent; We Aren’t-Episode 12
Parks & Recollections
From bear cubs to bandstands, Chris Tuttle’s 36-year ride through Staunton’s parks proves the grass really is greener where you water it. In this unfiltered season finale, he shares stories of wrangling raccoons, defining learning moments, and the community spirit that makes it all worth it.
About This Podcast
The U may be silent, but Staunton has a lot to say. Join Visit Staunton as we sit down with inspiring individuals at the top of their craft. We’re chatting about what drives their passion, the actions behind the impact, and a little about the place where they’re making it all happen.
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TRANSCRIPT
Welcome back to the You Is Silent, We Aren’t podcast for the season finale. It has been such a fun journey. So thank you, everybody that has listened, watched, chatted with us and told their story. I know I have had a blast and I hope you guys have too. And so continue checking in with us on this ride as we see what’s next. But we are so happy for the final guest of this season. Could
9 sec.
Couldn’t have asked for a better storyteller for one thing and someone that’s so connected to Staunton and to many people listening in probably. So please help me welcome Chris Tuttle, the director of Parks and Rec for City of Staunton. I don’t know if I can stand up to that or not. I know that was a good one. It was good. It was good. Thank you so much for joining us. You have been.
34 sec.
with the city for like 35 years a little bit of a story with that i i uh i came in 1985 a long time ago then the the first recreation director for the department was john lancaster he hired me i was right out of college i was with the city for two and a half years as the athletic uh director for parks and rec we did all the athletics and leagues and
57 sec.
It was a great learning experience. I learned everything for my career when I started out here. So after two and a half years, I got the opportunity to go home to Bath County, which they say you should never go work where you were raised. But I went back. I was hired as the recreation director for Bath County. That was a four-year stint. I would still be in Bath County if it wasn’t for John Lancaster. Mm-hmm.
1 min. 23 sec.
called me one day and said, I got a job opening superintendent of Parks and Rec. You know, I think you’d be good for it. Would you, would you apply, you know, and, and come back? Well, I was happy in Bath County. I lived on a farm, a cattle farm on the Calpasta River, just me and my dogs. I was content. Like a country song right there. It was great.
1 min. 53 sec.
you know, I loved it. And so I go to the county administrator at the time who was Bill Manion, great guy. And he says, I hate to lose you, but you’ve got to go. If they offer you the job, you got to go for the potential of what could be. So I debated, I debated. So I talked to my landlord who was an inspiration to me, Ed Walters in Bath County owned the cattle farm I lived on in
2 min. 19 sec.
He said, you got to do it. And then he gave me the piece of advice that I’ve never forgot all my life, which is so true. He said, you’re going to work all your life to get back to where you’re at right now. And he said that because I lived in a cabin on the Calpaster River on a thousand acre farm. It was paradise. But Bath County’s home. I knew I’d always have a chance. My parents are still in Bath County.
2 min. 49 sec.
I knew I would end up back there someday, which I have a camp out there. So I’m out, you know, frequently on weekends. But so I come back to stand and I’m the superintendent of parks and rec. Now we have two people that do that job. And at that time,
3 min. 18 sec.
Parks and Rec, the park maintenance side of it, we had 40 maintenance workers out of that shop. Now we have 11. But at that time, park maintenance did all the janitorial for the city. We did all the trades, the plumbing, the electrical and all that. So I was thrown into that, which was a fantastic learning experience. Yeah.
3 min. 36 sec.
And, you know, then I also handled all the recreation, the childcare, the camps and all that. So I come to Staunton, you know, I was commuting from Bath County. I knew that I knew the job because I’d been there before. So that made it easier to transition. Some of the people were still there. Right. So John Lancaster, who hired me originally in 85, who calls me back.
3 min. 59 sec.
I’d been with the city maybe, I don’t know, several months. And John calls me in his office and gives me the news that he has cancer, which he was a mentor to me at that time. And he basically, he was the first recreation director. So he started it, you know, so he, a lot of the things we have now are due to his good work. So he told me, he said, you know, you’re going to learn there. I will teach you everything I know. And, you know, you stay in my hip pocket as we go through this.
4 min. 23 sec.
And I didn’t know what the outcome would be with his cancer. But he even had me at times take him to his treatments at UVA. And I can remember going over half the mountain and he never stopped talking from the time we left Staunton to the treatment, giving me, it was all about work. You got to know this person, you know that person. Yeah.
4 min. 55 sec.
this civic club does this. You need to reach out.” And he was big in civic clubs. And I understand why we can get in that later as my career went on. But so John, he had a battle, he went through, and I think maybe six, eight months after that, he passed away, which was devastating to me. Sure. And the staff that we had staff that had been there with him from the start. And here I am now, the new guy, I’m not even 30,
5 min. 17 sec.
Just hoping everything he breathed into you stuck. Yeah, yeah. So I had to do all that. And I’m thinking, you know, I guess the greatest advice I ever received was from my grandfather, who was at the first wave at Omaha Beach. He said, you never let fear stand in the way of your success. So I used to keep that in mind. I was scared to death. What’s going to happen? What am I? Now it’s on me, right? Yeah.
5 min. 46 sec.
So a month or two goes, I get a call from the city manager, uh, uh, Bernie Murphy. He was the first city manager when I came in, you know, it was the superintendent. I knew Bernie well, he was, uh, quite a character, but he was old school. You know, as a matter of fact, this is how it is. Uh, he didn’t play very much. It was serious business. So I go to his office and he goes, yeah, I can remember he was looking out the window toward the wharf and he spun around in a chair and he said,
6 min. 14 sec.
you’re the new parks and rec director. Don’t mess it up. And I was like, all right. Yep. Thanks a lot. Matter of fact. Perfect. Yep. You know, and I think his style, when I started as director, I needed that. Uh, he was stern at work, but he was super nice on that. When you were not at work, he demanded from his staff, um,
6 min. 44 sec.
So there was again, but I’ll go back to, as I go through this, uh, there’s always somebody in my life that’s gave me the, the step up or the good advice, put it that way. That was always went out on a limb for me. Hey, Chris is Chris might be good. And, and, and I’ll start out with, uh, my mother and father. Uh, my dad was a game warden for the state for, for close to 40 years. My mom, uh.
7 min. 8 sec.
ran a beauty salon and this is in a little town of Millboro out in Bath County. Well, how I even ended up in Staunton, it’s the irony of it. It’s crazy. My mother is cutting hair. This lady comes in and she asked about me. How’s Chris? Well, mom says, well, Chris just finished college and he’s working over at Lake Moomaw. What’s his degree in? Well, he’s got a part, he parks and rec and, you know, a double in history. Yeah.
7 min. 37 sec.
So the lady tells my mom, there’s a position open in Staunton, I think. Right? So my intentions when I got out of college was I was going to be a game warden like my dad. And if that didn’t work out, I was going to be a history teacher and coach football. Yeah. Right? But, you know, recreation, I was interested in it in college. And I thought, man, can you actually make a living doing this? Let’s be honest. That’s my thought at the time. Sure. Yeah.
8 min. 10 sec.
I go to Staunton then the whole story what i just talked about with john lancaster they hire me i come there game commission now is a memory and i’m rolling at Staunton starting to think this is you know i’m making a living doing this this is great that’s a lot of work i mean you’re working back then we were you know we were doing 70 hours a week so uh
8 min. 40 sec.
So then it just transitioned on. And again, it’s those people that helped me, that put me in the place, that took a chance on me when I really wouldn’t have took the chance myself. They saw the potential in you. I think so. I didn’t see where I was, but I always went back to, I can’t let fear stand in the way. And you were smart enough to listen. I did listen. Yep. Well, I admired the people that gave me advice. John Lancaster, Mr. Walters, um.
9 min.
County Administrator Manion, all these people, Bernie Murphy, all the city managers I’ve worked for. I’ve been blessed in a career that even to this day, I think you’ve done this for 36 years. Well, total in the career since college is 38 years. And it’s went by like that. Let me ask you, because I know there’s so many people that have been behind you. And you mentioned your dad being a game warden. So what?
9 min. 25 sec.
Where did the initial interest in outdoors in general come from? When did you decide whatever field it’s going to be, I want to be out in nature and outdoors? I grew up in Bath County as a son of a game warden, which I mentioned. My dad was my hero, still is. He’s one of the few people that I knew that his job was a passion. It was not a job to him. And when he retired, it was hard. I mean, he was 68, I think, when he retired. Mm-hmm.
9 min. 53 sec.
but he he defined himself as the game warden right so as a young boy growing up you know i can still see my dad in his uniform uh almost like in a kid’s view super superhero he’s fighting a good fight he’s stopping the bad guys from killing animals you know all that so as i got older
10 min. 22 sec.
I worked for the game commission as a kid. I stocked trout. I worked at deer check stations. As I got into college and later in high school, I worked at Lake Moomaw. I don’t feel like I’ve ever worked a day in my life. I really don’t. So that’s why I’m fortunate in how my father’s career, I learned he was a passion. He never felt like, oh, I got to get up and go to work. Right.
10 min. 46 sec.
That’s how I feel. Yeah. It was just an extension of his life. Yeah. 38 years later, you’re defined by it. Whether you intend that, that’s the outcome, but it is. So my children know me, the Parks and Rec guy.
11 min. 11 sec.
I think, you know, cause that’s all they know. Yeah. You know. But I think that is something that you have done really, really well is because you do see it as an extension of, of yourself and the community. And, and so Gypsy Hill Park, for example, we both know is, is the top, top visited attraction in all of Staunton. And we have so many amazing attractions, but Gypsy Hill continues to be the top visited. How do you go about that?
11 min. 24 sec.
cultivating this attractive green space that is also so welcoming for a community that lives there, but also visitors coming in. Like, how have you gone about doing that? You know, it’s going to go back to the history. And I’m passionate about history, but it’s a fine line between modern and the old. So Gypsy Hill Park, I’ve learned real quick that the residents of Staunton…
11 min. 53 sec.
really don’t like too much change in Gypsy Hill Park. Sure. Right? And some of it’s legitimate. And through my career, I’ve had several stumbles to where you think you could do certain things and you can’t. But I think what draws people to Gypsy Hill, it’s more of a, we’re fortunate, you know, and I’ve never taken that for granted ever. But I think that we, that sometimes, and I’m guilty of it too,
12 min. 23 sec.
you don’t realize what you you’re you’re around it so much until you leave and go somewhere else and you think man we have a part like gypsy hill in Staunton and then you have a montgomery hall park which is massive then they’re both totally separate totally different yeah but they complement
12 min. 51 sec.
anybody’s needs in the city, whether you like to go more outdoors, Montgomery Hall. But then again, we’ve got your athletic complexes there. You’ve got more picnic shelters there. You’ve got a pool there. And the history there is as deep as the history in Gypsy Hill. Yeah. Maybe more so. But you come in the front of Gypsy Hill Park. So today, as we’re sitting here today, if you went into the park and you look at the entrance, that’s how it looked.
13 min. 11 sec.
In 1891, 92. And the reason it looks like that is because of Bill Frazier with Frazier and Associates. Bill and I talked for years about it just casually. Bill, man, I would love to remodel the front of the park to make it look like it did.
13 min. 40 sec.
So, and it, and it became more than that. So when I tell Bill that he immediately says, well, we can do that. And he formed this committee and they raised the funds. And so now when you look at, we had a story brick Mason come in, redo the columns. Fortunately, the city, uh,
14 min. 1 sec.
We had a superintendent who retired several years ago, Steve DeVinney, who had been with the city for 40 some years, who had saved the bollards from the original. They were on the truck to go to the landfill. That was forward thinking. Right. Well, he always, and we kept them behind our maintenance shop. He said, you never know, we might need them. And I’m like, yeah, don’t get rid of them because they’re historic, right? So we started a renovation project. I told Bill, I said, Bill, we have them.
14 min. 20 sec.
We have the globe. That’s the original globe or the ironwork. Yeah. And the spring boxes that you look at, that’s how they look back in the day. All the spring boxes had tops on them, the copper tops, and we did the signage and all that with the history. So not only are you celebrating the history, but it also improved the interest of the park. So it’s a fine line, but it’s the number one attraction. We’ve had people years ago, I had a –
14 min. 47 sec.
a small town and I can’t think of it come down from New York and took pictures and they wanted to duplicate, they were building a park and they wanted to duplicate the park. Now there’s stories that I can’t confirm it. So this might be just a straight up lie, but I’m just going to tell it anyway. You say it with enough certainty. Well, I’m not, yeah.
15 min. 17 sec.
So supposedly, this is what I’ve heard from when I first started from some Stauntonians that were into the history, that Gypsy Hill was somewhat laid out similar to Central Park in New York City. And that Olmstead came down and met with Proviance Tams, that’s who’s the founder of Gypsy Hill Park, and they laid it out. So if you take them both and look, they are similar. Yeah. I want to believe that’s true. Yeah.
15 min. 40 sec.
I can see it How many acres is Gypsy Hill is 215 With the golf course Montgomery Hall is 148 Oh, I didn’t realize that much over at Montgomery also Yeah, and they are They Yeah
16 min. 9 sec.
even the other parks that we have as well, they each have their own personality and flair. Unfortunately, very close to, uh, to gypsy Hills. So it’s great. We can walk down just the other night. It was, it was so great. So we were able just to take a stroll and, and, and check everything out before my son had to go to bed. Um, and then this, this weekend we were able to go over to Montgomery because I want to do a little hike and climb on stuff and jump in dirt and, and each has its own, um, its own personality. I guess it,
16 min. 23 sec.
knowing all of your parks so intimately and so well is there anything that stands out that you’ve discovered between the parks kind of thinking about how different they are well i think it’s history i think that’s the difference the the history of both parks is so so uh interesting to um
16 min. 52 sec.
And there’s some little tidbits that I think are interesting that I found out when I came here. I don’t know how many folks know that Betsy Bell was a gift to the city. And when it was deeded to the city in the 40s, in the deed, it states that city council, the majority of city council has to go to the top of the mountain and go to the overlook and reflect on the state of the city.
17 min. 14 sec.
So for 36 years, I have personally driven city council to the top of the mountain. Yeah. And they all get out and take a photo. It used to be in the leader paper, a picture. So that’s cool. That’s just unique. It’s cool. You know, I think it’s, again, forward thinking for the person that gifted it. Because if they don’t make their trip, then it’s null and void and it goes back to the family.
17 min. 41 sec.
But there’s all kind of little history things that we’ll discover that I find fascinating in Gypsy Hill is what’s under the ground. And the reason I say that, that Gypsy Hill was the city’s water source. Right. The first building you come when you see at the entrance, that was the old pump house. Now it’s the Stonewall Brigade band room. We’re constantly finding…
18 min. 12 sec.
artifacts from the day of how they pump water to the city or the terracotta water lines and the handmade fittings and concrete junction boxes. Every time we have a water leak in the park in Gypsy Hill, it’s eventually a spring that we didn’t know we had. Oh, so a whole new source there.
18 min. 36 sec.
The work with the restoration, the Gypsy Hill Stream Restoration Project. Big project right now. They’re constantly finding water. Where does that come from? We don’t know. So we go back and engineers, they can’t find this. There’s no record. And then they dig a little more. But still, there’s some areas we don’t know where the water is coming from. That’s so interesting. The water that feeds the duck pond, which that’s a whole other story. We can get into that. I don’t know if I’m going to even broach the conversation, but one of my favorite things is hearing you talk about the ducks and the duck pond.
18 min. 57 sec.
that’s a treasure in itself. Yeah. But the water that comes to the duck pond, that feeds the duck pond, comes from a spring on the golf course behind the park maintenance shop. That is a tremendous span for that water to run. Yeah. So it runs all the way through. And that was, again, that dates, predates, that’s original to the park. That pond came in in the, it was a little bit later, but,
19 min. 26 sec.
So, we can talk about the duck pond. The duck pond is the number one attraction in the park, right? We have swans, mute swans. And a little side story on that, the swans have been in the park for 100 years, right? They’ve been in the park for 100 years. And I can tell a funny story about how I come to learn that the mute swans that we have are an invasive species, all right?
19 min. 55 sec.
So years ago, it was an annual, the swans would breed, they’d hatch, and the little cygnets would swim around, and the leader paper would do a really cool story out. And we did that for years. That was even before I became director.
20 min. 25 sec.
So this is several years ago. This thing goes out in the newspaper about the Little Swans. I get a call from Richmond. It’s from the Virginia Game Commission. Now, I knew some of these from my dad, and some of these guys still work. Yes.
20 min. 41 sec.
So I said, you know, I answer the phone. Is this Chris Tuttle? Yes, it is. Is your dad Bill Tuttle? I’m like, it is. How are you doing? He said, you remember me? You know, we had a nice little conversation. He said, hey. He said, you of all people ought to know that ignorance of the law is not an excuse. And I’m like, or however the term goes. And I’m like, what? And he says, mute swans. He said, they’re an invasive species. But we do give permits for them.
21 min.
And he said, you and he said, since you’ve had them so long, you can keep them. I think Maymont Garden, there’s another place that has them. So I didn’t know that. So I go fill out the paperwork. I have we have permits for him. I said, they’re a treasured part of the party. He said, yeah, we’re not going to tell you just you got to have a permit.
21 min. 27 sec.
And the reason they’re an invasive species, that’s down on the Chesapeake Bay, right? I would have no idea. I didn’t know. I never think that, yeah. So it was my ignorance of the law. That’s good logic. So they’re kind of special birds. We have a sign there that tells all that on the side there. Mm-hmm.
21 min. 49 sec.
The majority of the inhabitants are wild. They’re mallard ducks. They come and go. But then they become domesticated because they know we’re feeding. And we do. We feed twice a day. We’re in and out of there all day checking. The pond itself has the koi. And several years ago, we drained it and had to dredge it, which we have to do about every 10 years and clean it a little bit.
22 min. 7 sec.
the artifacts we found in the duck pond were fascinating from the 40s uh world war ii toys and all kind of that were that you can envision a child just throw it in uh antique bottles um so again i mean it’s just you know you think of Staunton a lot of people think of gypsy hill park they do yeah and for you know again my whole career i have told you this the other day
22 min. 33 sec.
I have never gotten tired of driving through the park. And I do it two to three times a day, both of them.
23 min. 1 sec.
You know, I make the turn and I’m like, man, this is awesome. This is cool. You know, and that’s for 30 some years. I’ve been doing that every day. And I tell everybody you have. And of course, your guys’s offices administration are over at Montgomery, Montgomery Hall Park. And I always tell them, like, you guys got the best space. It is the best. You really do. I’m jealous. It’s a beautiful place to have an office. Yeah.
23 min. 7 sec.
And again, that park, the history there, it’s amazing too. So again, for a city the size of Staunton. Yeah. And that’s not all we have, Gypsy Hill or Montgomery Hall. It’s Betsy Bell, Mary Gray. You got Landis Park. You got Woodrow Park. I don’t know if most folks know about Knowles Park. It’s right across from the entrance to the park, and it’s –
23 min. 31 sec.
very tiny and there’s no sidewalk or anything to it but it’s a it was gifted to the city and we put a plaque on it in old’s park yeah so it works now i’ve got to ask you because i do still have more questions regarding parks and your work and outdoors however i need you to share
23 min. 56 sec.
the bear story so you told me this i think my first my first day i was probably when uh we were yeah yeah so our sea manager leslie she was like you know what best person to give you the tour throughout the community is chris and and throughout that conversation you shared you grew up with a bear i did please tell for a brief time i will so again it’s going back to my father
24 min. 15 sec.
So we moved to New Market. When my dad first got on with the Game Commission, his first duty station, I guess if you’d call it, was New Market, Luray, right? So this is in the 60s, and this is long before the Wildlife Center was even a thing. So back then when the game warden confiscated an animal,
24 min. 40 sec.
They raised it as best they could and then turned it back into the wild. And that’s from us, you know, so my brother’s two years old. I was six. My brother’s eight. So we were raising, you know, deer, raccoons. He’d bring home turkeys. We lived on a farm at the bottom of the mountain as you go up to Luray. So my dad comes home and he’s got a black bear. And it’s, I mean, a little bear. My mom had to feed it with a bottle.
24 min. 58 sec.
So what do you do with it? So we can’t leave it outside. Mom kept it. We kept it in the house. And it was actually in a box, you know, in there. So she’d get up and she’d feed it. And I can’t remember how long it was with us, but it got to where it was.
25 min. 25 sec.
you know, could get around and do certain things. But so we were the two kids in the New Market area that were known as the kids that had the bear. Yeah, the small town. Everybody wanted to come and see the bear. That word travels quickly. It does travel quick. Especially with a bear. So we have pictures, and I tried to find one of the pictures before I came to show it to you, of me and my brother sitting on a couch. And this isn’t a picture.
25 min. 39 sec.
appropriate, but me and my brother are sitting on the couch and the bear, and we’re all drinking a bottle of Coke. But it’s a little, the bear is little, right? So he’s not a full grown bear. He’s not a year old. He was big enough to go to the refrigerator in our house. This is true. All this is true. And he got to where he could open the door to the refrigerator and get his bottle. Part of the family.
26 min. 4 sec.
And it’s just one of those stories. So my brother went on, I said, and moved to Northern Virginia. And he was one of the editors for Newsweek magazine. And his tagline was the only Newsweek editor that ever raised a bear as a kid. So my dad for his whole career had a picture on his desk. His office was at the house of the bear hugging a fence post.
26 min. 32 sec.
And then there was a picture of my dad. And then it got to where the Washington Post, I told you that story, came and did a story on the bear that the game warden was raising. And so I think that in my childhood was like, it was almost at that time, the TV shows were like Gentle Ben, Daniel Boone, etc.
26 min. 58 sec.
And it was like, hey, we got a bear. It’s natural. But I can’t remember how long the bear, my dad will say, oh, we didn’t have it that long. But then my mom will say, well, you know, all these stories, we had to have it a while. And I can’t remember when it left. Did it go to the, I’ve heard that it went to the zoo. Then I heard it was released up on the mountain in Luray. I think that’s more logical. But how can you top that? I mean, as a kid, that was like the pinnacle of, yeah, we got a bear. Yeah.
27 min. 16 sec.
And it was a black bear. I mean, it was, you know.
27 min. 45 sec.
You know, in like throughout school or whatever, the icebreaker games where you have to tell whether it be two truths and a lie or whatever, that would always win, right? Like that would win every single time. Yeah, but it was just a great memory. And even to, you know, my brother and I talk about it all the time. And as you know, where I’m at 62, my brother’s 64, your memories on that, you know, but it was, it was great. Yeah. Well, it’s so interesting because you, you grew up with, um.
27 min. 48 sec.
very much with a hands-on approach to nature and outdoors. And then early on when you started your career in Staunton, I mean, there were a few different controversies that involved nature and animals, especially from peacocks to raccoons to deer to, you know, swans. How did you navigate all that to not be,
28 min. 16 sec.
Let it scare you, but like, did it seem natural to go through all that to, to now be 35 years out? So, so one of the, one of the, so I came when I took over as director, right? I’m 29. I think getting ready to turn 30. We had, this is Bernie Murphy was city manager again, you know, and I get a letter one day and it’s a backtrack a little bit.
28 min. 40 sec.
So the bear cage that’s in the park, it did have bears, but not, I mean, long, long ago. So there is a bear cage in the park for anybody listening not aware in Gypsy Hill. There are not bears in it. Correct. Your family bear is not in this. No, he’s not. It’s now like a garden space. So originally in the park years and years ago, I’m taking 20s, 30s. Yeah. There was a monkey house in Gypsy Hill Park. That building’s now gone. That used to be the first home of the Parks and Rec was the monkey house. Yeah.
29 min. 4 sec.
And it was right as you come into the park by the duck pond. And that was torn down. And that’s where the police substation is now. Oh, okay. So they actually had monkeys in there. This is what I’m here. I’ve never seen photos of those monkeys, but I have seen photos of the black bear in the cage. So it’s called the bear cage.
29 min. 32 sec.
But as things progressed, the bear went away. Raccoons stayed. I remember raccoons and the bear. And I remember 92, 93, maybe 1992, 93. I get a letter from the federal government. There was also a deer lot. We kept white-tailed deer in an enclosure. And I get a letter from the federal government. It says, we classify your enclosure as a zoo.
29 min. 52 sec.
If you want to continue to operate, here’s what you got to do. It was like triple fencing, which we did have veterinary. If something happened, we did. But the food, the this and the this and that. I remember going to Bernie Murphy. And again, I told you he’s a no-nonsense guy. He just says, get rid of them. And I said, Bernie, this is one of those issues in Stanton that’s going to cause problems. People loved it. You used to it, yeah. Get rid of them. All right? So we get rid of the deer. Yeah.
30 min. 21 sec.
It didn’t go over well. We got rid of the raccoons, not so much on that other than people felt sorry for the raccoons because they were so morbidly obese for people feeding them. They were feeding them all the time. Oh yeah. They couldn’t even hardly walk. So that disappeared. The deer went to North Mountain. We released them. People were really upset about that. And we used to have a lot of folks will remember the peacocks that walked apart. I’ve heard. Which disappeared under my tenure with another feather in my cap.
30 min. 52 sec.
So I was just good. I was just, I was just bang, bang, bang. Right. First couple of years, I figured I’m not going to be here long. They’re going to cut and be loose. I got guys out of here. Send me back to Bath-Cali. So we get rid of the deer. We weathered that storm and it all worked out.
31 min. 22 sec.
And then the mini train, which is so popular. Oh, that’s amazing. Still to this day. So the Bartlett family owned the train. They ran it for years and they gave a lot of the proceeds to the Moose and we’ll have some playground equipment from them. So it was just a mainstay in the park. And it’s an exact replica of whatever model train that is, right? And it goes through and you got your tunnel. Yeah.
31 min. 41 sec.
Well, the Bartleys had grown to where they just couldn’t do it anymore and they wanted to give it to the city. So they gifted it to the city. And then we took it over. We run the train. We had no training experience at all. Right? I tell the city manager, I said, well, yeah, we’ll do it. We can’t take it out of the park. Right.
32 min. 9 sec.
So we were on the train and then we start having derailments. We’re not engineers, right? And I don’t quite have conductors. I mean, it’s not good to have the mini train derailing with kids on it. And it did happen. Sure. So again, I go to city manager. I said, Bernie, what do you want me to do? He goes, get the rec commission and we got to do something. I said, we can’t operate it. We’re going to hurt somebody.
32 min. 28 sec.
Go to the rec commission. The rec commission supports, hey, we got to get rid of it. You know, and it’s more on my, that was my recommendation. The commission’s backing me. And my recommendation was solely based on, I don’t want to be the guy that hurts, that a child gets hurt, right? And it was unsafe.
32 min. 58 sec.
So then we thought, all right, well, let’s see if we can find an expert out there, which we did. We found a guy in Roanoke that runs Mill Mountain Zoo that had to train. He comes, he says, oh, this track’s old. We need to pull this track up. You know, you got to really inspect this thing daily. You need to gauge the track. And I’m standing there like, oh, my God, this is Parks and Rec. You know, we’re not engineers.
33 min. 18 sec.
So the brain that I am, I go to the manager and says, we need to get rid of this train. Shut it down. Right now. I’m taking the stance. And it was all based on sincerity. Safety. Safety. Yeah. But I was naive to the fact I didn’t think. I thought, okay, well, it’s over. It’s done. But the outcry, which I get. Imagine people were not happy. We’re not happy. Yeah.
33 min. 44 sec.
So here you are, you’re a young director, you’re nervous enough when you’re doing a council presentation. Now you know that what you’re saying is not popular. When everybody in the room is not going to like it. Right. So I do my spiel. I think it was tabled the first time because, to be honest, council at that time did not want it. I get it. We’re like, we need more information, right? So it comes back.
34 min. 12 sec.
This is like a two-month, just imagine the stress of all time thinking, but I’m still in my mind like, I don’t care because it’s safety. We’ll talk about a little later about civic-minded folks in Staunton. We go to this meeting, John Zinn steps up and he’s a local guy. He says, we have formed a committee of retired trained CNO guys that hobby.
34 min. 42 sec.
And we want to form this committee and we’ll take it over. So now from that, you know, a lot of people don’t know the story, but it’s the Gypsy Express. 100% due to them. They saved it, them alone. I’m forever grateful for my career as I went on through. And it’s now toward the end of my career that they stepped up because they did it. They did it better than it’s ever been done. And what they do for the kids.
35 min. 15 sec.
And the amount that they’ve put into it with their fundraising. And, you know, it used to be just one tunnel. Now it’s two. They’re constantly down there working on the track, working on the engine. Well, what a testament to, I think, the community ownership of the spaces, too. And that’s…
35 min. 45 sec.
Really something that I think has been a catalyst for all of our parks is the community buy-in. Because we’re seeing a lot of traditions stay, but also so many new things. I mean, the Christmas lights stay busy. Well, I definitely want to touch on music in the park and what that looks like. Pride is hosted at Gypsy Hill. There’s the African American Cultural Heritage Festival hosted at Gypsy Hill. And there’s so many different organizations that come to the table. And it’s this joint effort.
36 min. 4 sec.
one, to provide the physical structures in the park to make these things happen, but also the programming collaboration that happens too. Oh, yeah. What’s your guys’ thought process on that as you guys continue to try and hold tradition of the park and what everybody loves, but also moving forward in programming and things that people are wanting and hoping for? Yeah. I mean, I’ll just touch on what the civic-mindedness of Staunton and the parks that you know of today, right today.
36 min. 32 sec.
would not be what they are without the civic groups. And you can go through the list of all of them in the city, from the Lions, from the Elks, to the Eagles, to the Moose, to the Kiwanis, to the Rotary. Every building, you come into the park, it’s the Kiwanis built the bandstand. The Rotary built the concession that’s beside the bandstand. The tot lot in the West End was Moose money from the revenue from the mini train.
37 min.
Gypsy Hill, rotary pavilions, playground donations, Augusta Greater Realtors Association put in a handicap playground. So it’s endless. Duck Pond originally was built by the Lions Club. So you look at all your attractions that people love, they’re all there because of the Lions or the civic groups that did it. So the fine line between the old and the new is I think Gypsy Hill right now,
37 min. 27 sec.
there’s no more room for expansion there’s no more room for new you know the some of the new that i think about is like skate park so dog park um that’s all on which is still gypsy park but i always call it the athletic end it’s where the stadiums yeah stadiums are um but again with the dog park both the dog park and the skate park were citizen driven right so
37 min. 55 sec.
The skate park, that was really popular. And it still is. But 20 years ago, it was like the thing, right? So some kids from the high school formed a group. Some parents got involved. We met and met. And what do you want? So when we did the skate park, we let the kids design it. They’re using it. I’m not. Yeah. Right? So the first skate park, because we’ve had to modify it over the years, was Tony Hawk Grant.
38 min. 25 sec.
It funded the ramps and things. And then over the time, we’ve had to bring more folks in. Hey, what do you want this? You’re like, he’s half pipe. You’re like, yes. And I thought, to be honest, I said when we did it, I said this isn’t going to last. They’re going to cycle out. A lot of the stuff does. This didn’t. It’s still there. It’s still popular. Dog Park right next door, same thing. Civic Park.
38 min. 57 sec.
Or a citizen minded, we need a dog park. So what do I do? I think I don’t, at that time, I’m like, well, I don’t really, you know, seriously. Right. So I go to Salem, visit their dog park. I go to Roanoke City, made a trip to Richmond. I thought, whatever my opinion is, this, you know, at the time. Mm-hmm.
39 min. 24 sec.
This is pretty cool. This is legit and not much expense other than the fence. You know, and it’s funny how things happen with the dog park. We agreed on that site, had an individual that worked for the city that was remodeling his backyard and had a bunch of black chain link fencing. Hey, you want that? Yes, please. Yeah. So we did. We went and got it, which was a great gift. Yeah. He was going to take it to the landfill, I guess, but it was new. Yeah. Yeah.
39 min. 46 sec.
Then we made that, then things, once you have a facility, then we have it. I started thinking, we need lights. We’ve got to get lights, right? So it takes process. Things take a while. So I put it in a CIP. It starts working its way up through the capital improvement projects. Last year, we put lights up. So now it’s lit. Yeah. And we’re getting all kind of great comments from folks with that.
40 min. 15 sec.
So our role, my role and the staff is we serve the city. We work for you. You know, people, a lot of times people will call my office and they’ll go, I hate to call you, but I’d rather you call me. Just tell me. I don’t care. You know, I love the calls that say we’re great and we do great things. But I like to hear the things that you’re upset about. Or maybe, hey, did you know this wasn’t working or this?
40 min. 42 sec.
Sometimes we overlook. Yeah. We don’t see it. And that’s something I hope people know is how open the parks department here. Well, really, every department is to community input. Like, we want it. We need it. Oh, I’d say that’s citywide. And I think everything that you described, too, is such a reason why, you know, we talked about earlier how Gypsy Hill and really just the city as a whole.
41 min. 9 sec.
We see such a balance between community locals, but also visitors experiencing the same thing. And I think Gypsy Hill kind of encompasses that in a nutshell. The statement’s true. A place people want to live is a place people want to visit. Right. And that’s why we see that crossover. I know we’re starting to wind down. So I do, because I have one more question I want to ask you in a minute. But before then, can you touch on…
41 min. 32 sec.
Some of the programming that you guys do, especially music in the parks. I am so fortunate because like I said, I live very close and there’s some nights I can, I can even hear, but when the summer get, have you ever watched the show Gilmore girls? Yeah. Okay. I can’t tell you how often I.
41 min. 57 sec.
I get told or asked the comparison between Stars Hollow, right? This make-believe place is compared to Staunton. Like one geographically, like we’re so close to… We’re in a rural area, but we’re so close to…
42 min. 14 sec.
We’re a Victorian downtown, but also close to Metropolitan. We’re close to the beach. We’re close to all these things. And then you go into Gypsy Hill, and that’s where especially we get the comparison. One, the aesthetics of the bandstand, but there’s music happening five days a week in the summer. There’s a train running through. There’s people just having picnics. There’s just…
42 min. 31 sec.
It really is like where you just feel so great and it, you look around and there’s so many different backgrounds and people are just enjoying together. Yeah. Yeah. So I think, you know, in programming that when we do, it’s just so much different than when I started, when I first started, it was, it was predominantly youth sports, adult athletics. Right. And you did a little bit of like programs actually. So, but now it’s,
42 min. 53 sec.
I hope everyone gets our brochure that comes out and it lists all the different activities or something in there for somebody. Yeah. Right. And it tells you everything. At all ages. At all ages. All ages. Yeah. Seniors, youth, we do summer camps. We have after school programs. Yeah. We do everything from sign language classes to cards to… Yeah.
43 min. 21 sec.
from CPR to sock hops. Oh yeah, all of them. We just had a senior dance last weekend. We had the road bowling event at the Frontier Culture Museum Saturday. Yeah, it’s never ending. And that goes to the staff that work there, everybody that works in the office. And this might be cliche, but everybody there is passionate about what they do. If you’re in Parks and Rec,
43 min. 40 sec.
You’re passionate. I mean, that’s what you want to do. And so, and we have very little turnover over my career. I’ve kept, I’ve been fortunate to keep people. Um, and I don’t know in the last year or so we’ve had some retirees go out and then some younger fresh ideas coming in, which is great. Um,
44 min. 4 sec.
But we cover everything. But the thing that I think that when I have visitors come in that will go out and they come to Gypsy Hill Park and they’re like from a big metropolitan area, like Charlotte, some of my sister-in-law, this is in the middle of the city? You know, how much is it? Nothing. Right. So the bandstand, that’s a key part of the park for festivals, events, music. And I don’t know if you’ll go anywhere where you’re going to find Monday night
44 min. 23 sec.
concert it’s big band all right tuesday night is praise in the park wednesday night which i’m really proud of is bluegrass in the park thursday’s jazz in the park jazz has been going on i think 30 plus years uh friday night is movie night that we do with her uh screen and
44 min. 54 sec.
But Bluegrass in the Park, there’s a little history of how that started. And we’re drawing crowds that are really, really good crowds. It’s nothing to have 1,500 people in the park on a Wednesday night. On a Wednesday night. And why is it on a Wednesday night? So when we first started the Bluegrass, and folks will remember the name when I say it, Ray Hauser, who was one of those guys in my life and career that was just always there for me.
45 min. 13 sec.
Never said no. He was a radio legend around here for years. Old school guy. He was a great guy. So Ray and I decided we were going to do a bluegrass festival. One day, Ray said, let’s call it the one-day festival.
45 min. 44 sec.
So we did it on Sundays and we had good, decent crowd. Not, we had good, good acts. And then we did it another year. And then Ray says, he used to call me boss. He said, boss, let’s go to lunch. I’m meeting for lunch. We met down the Rouse restaurant. He said, we got to change this up or do it or not do it. Cause we’re there all day. And the crowds aren’t what we want. Yeah.
46 min. 2 sec.
And I said, well, Ray, Wednesday nights are open during the week. And he said, well, can you do bluegrass? Think you can get the money to do the bluegrass? And I said, I’ll get the money. So we call bluegrass in the park. So when we first started out, we figured out real quick we were on to something. So the unique thing about a Wednesday night for the acts, if you’re into the bluegrass world, we have the best of the best that travel and play at the Opry. And the reason that I can get them and can afford them
46 min. 25 sec.
is that they’re traveling. And if I can catch them when they’re running down 64 or 81, they’re not going to turn down gas money to play and sell product. This year we have the Cody Norris show.
46 min. 56 sec.
that were on the Opry last weekend. Kevin Prater Band, right from where you’re home. Yeah, it was the first Bluegrass Night I got to attend. And we started listening. We’re like, look at the name. Like, I think we know them. Yeah, from the same area. And he just recently won a bunch of IBMA awards and awards.
47 min. 11 sec.
And it’s entirely free. It’s free. You can just come in, bring a seat, and just hang out. So we’re seeing with Bluegrass, we’re drawing a regional crowd. There’s a group that comes from Greenbrier County, West Virginia, and stays in a hotel on Wednesday nights. They do it. Hey, we don’t have to buy a ticket. There’s families from Richmond that they were coming last year. I saw them a couple times. They’ll come down from Richmond for the concerts.
47 min. 28 sec.
And it depends on your act. Yeah. So what I do is I showcase the local talent as a 7 o’clock, and then at 8 o’clock is a headliner. Yeah. That’s amazing. And it’s one of those things I can’t give up. You know, I’m thinking, like I said, I’m looking down the road of retirement at some point.
47 min. 52 sec.
But I want to do that bluegrass. I got to, you know, I just want to keep doing it. You can just always be a spot there. You can be the intro guy for it. Yeah, the emcee. Final questions. I know we’re coming up and there’s just so much I could probably ask you. One of your career and your decisions and your leadership is just so inspiring. I am curious, though, have you ever had, I mean, you’re 35 plus years in here.
48 min. 13 sec.
the aha moment that you were exactly where you’re supposed to be? Oh yeah, I’ll tell you when. And it’s when I first came to the city in 85. This is the moment I knew that this is what I should be doing. There was a little kid, because at that time when I came in, I ran the summer camps. I was like, they thought of me as the principal, but I was the coordinator or whatever. And then I had pools and I had athletics, right?
48 min. 40 sec.
But there was this one little kid, this is 30 some years ago, at camp, who for whatever reason was attached to me at the hip. If they saw me, he’d come running. Something with you. Right? And I loved this kid. He was one of those kids you couldn’t help like, right? So that summer, I remember taking my wife now. She wasn’t in. We were at the movie theater here in Staunton. I can’t even remember what the movie was. And I hear in the back behind me is this little kid.
49 min. 9 sec.
That’s Mr. T. And he runs up and jumps up in my lap. Well, his mom comes over. Yeah. You know, she was like, you know, and I said, no, no, no, leave me alone. So he sat with us and watched the movie, right? Well, then I moved. I went to Bath County. Yeah. I came back. And about four years ago, I got a letter. I didn’t know the address. It worked. Yeah. And it opened it up, and it’s a picture of him as an adult thanking me for
49 min. 42 sec.
And I thought, you know, it was pretty emotional at the time. I could literally tear up thinking about it right now. And I thought that for whatever reason at that time in his life, whatever I did helped him. But then I thought, you know, and then I reached out to him and, you know, thanked him.
50 min. 8 sec.
But I think I was meant to do this. I don’t mean to sound like that’s braggadocious or whatever. I’m comfortable in it. It’s not a job. If it was a job, I could retire eight years ago. I just can’t give it up. I think that I make a difference, whatever difference that is. I mean, I know there’s folks that disagree sometimes with what I do, but it’s always for the right reason. I’ve never taken for granted my job or the position I’m in.
50 min. 29 sec.
And there’s sometimes I’ll go, how did you, you know, you’ve been the director. How did that happen? I mean, really? Yeah. So I never took for granted. I treated everybody that’s ever worked for me how I would want to be treated. I can’t remember. There’s a few times I’ve lost my temper, but not in front of people at work because they do it. If it wasn’t for them, I’m the coach. They do the work. Right. Right. Right.
51 min.
And throughout my career, I’ve had a lot of people leave to be their directors somewhere else. Great maintenance staff, great golf staff. Yeah. That’s a whole other story. Sure, yeah. Again, I don’t know how many folks know that golf course is over 100 years old. I know. That’s incredible. The forethought for what we have today at the time that folks actually got together and said, we need to do this is unheard of. Yeah. Really. I mean, Gypsy Hill, Montgomery Hall.
51 min. 28 sec.
And it’s not even when recreation was fashionable. Right. Because when I first got into the field, you do what? You’re a park center. What do you do? Play with kids? Right. And outside all day? But I think that is a big misconception. That’s why I say about tourism, it is so much fun. There’s a lot of work with it. But I never, like you said, I never take for granted how much
51 min. 59 sec.
fun we’re able to have. So I told, I think I told you this, but this is another thing where I knew I was supposed to do what I am doing now. This is 20 years ago. I had an offer to go to work for a big manufacturing heavy equipment company. I didn’t go look and they came to me. Would you, would you be interested? Right. And I thought, yeah, why not? So I go and
52 min. 21 sec.
I do the whole thing, interviews, multiple interviews. They offer me the job three times what I’m making here. I go to my father-in-law, who I had great respect for. He was president of Fleet Pharmaceuticals, old school businessman. He knew it. I said, can I ask you a question? I said, shoot me straight and don’t lie. I told him, he said, do you realize how many people would die to have the job you got right now?
52 min. 49 sec.
And I thought, no, I never thought of it like that.
53 min. 18 sec.
and i turned it down and it was the best decision i ever made another example somebody coming in giving me the advice i needed when i needed it yeah and then i took it you know being being smart enough to listen so i’m so thankful for well your time here today but also just great the leadership you’ve had even even in my time here so far just the example that you’ve said thank you for the community that you’ve built and and creating so many places not
53 min. 21 sec.
not cream but but lifting and loving and supporting so many spaces within our community that make us feel feel right at home it’s been my honor i can honestly say that yeah yeah it’s just a treasure of the whole city yeah and uh
53 min. 48 sec.
I hadn’t messed it up yet. Nope, doing all right. Well, thank you so much, Chris. And thank you guys all for joining us on this ride for the very first season of The U is Silent. We aren’t, we most certainly aren’t, but we have a good time in the process. So stay tuned for what’s to come next. And thank you to all of our guests. Thank you, Chris. And we’ll chat soon. Continue following Visit Staunton here. And if you like what you hear, like it, share it, give us a five star and continue listening. Thanks, guys.
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